the logic of a rape fantasy?

Discussion in 'General Sex Discussion' started by the_traveler, Jan 5, 2011.

  1. the_traveler

    the_traveler New Member

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    when i first heard of froyd's theroy of women fantay's of rape,i thought it was mere speculation, then i had a chance to talk to a japanease 23 year old who had such a fantasy.
    although it was "just" a fantasy i tried to convice her that it was illogical and a contradication, i know that fantasy is something that should not happen in reality (usually) but this is not like getting nailed by aliens.
    the very basic idea behind rape is the fact that a woman doesn't want it.
    and the fantasy is something you want. so therefore, how can you want not to want ? if you want it, it's not rape, if you don't want it, why think about it?
     
  2. Hot Wheels

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    Probably best described as role-play or...nonconsensual sex....:eyes
    Your not making a whole lot of sense here traveler...:ugh
     
  3. Texas_Red

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    No I get what he's saying. Rape is a matter of forced sex that is not wanted. When you fantasize it's something you do want. So in that sense, it's not really a rape, even though it is a fantasy.
     
  4. htoad

    htoad Active Member

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    Perhaps these are better described as "control" or "take me" fantasies, where the sex is desired but total control is given up where the man (within predefined bounds) can do anything he wants sexually with the woman and directs her actions. It does not have to be "rough" either, just the woman following every order the man directs.
     
  5. Texas_Red

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    Yes, but strictly within the definitions it's still not rape. That's all the OP is saying. I already understand what the allure of "rape" fantasies is.
     
  6. cbrmale

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    You are trying to tie sex to logic? I wish you well! Unless you're a creationist, we humans are the product of hundreds of thousands of years of evolution, and a fair bit of that evolution is about sex and reproduction. Hence, for a start, we are not naturally monogamous, and some theorise the rape fantasy enables a woman, who is basically non-mongamous, to have sex beyond her relationship, which is something that many in society condemn. There are other theories.

    A fairly large chunk of psychology is about sex, and if you want to understand sex and sex drives, then the best, and probably only way to do this is to study psychology at university level for a few years.
     
  7. andretti

    andretti New Member

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    I have submissive tendencies, and therefore have no problem understanding the "rape fantasy." Many submissives in the BDSM lifestyle embrace this paradox: craving what you don't want, dreading what you crave. There's an element that excites and titillates. Even if one isn't submissive, it's not hard to imagine a dark corner of someone's fantasy life where they might get excited about the idea of rape, in a very, very abstract way.

    Who wants to be spanked? Who wants to be humiliated? Doesn't seem logical - does it? Yet there are probably dozens of men who paid someone a good sum of money to enact that very fantasy last night, and hundreds more who got off by watching something just like it on a pornographic website.

    Judging by your post (and posts are easy to misinterpret, so forgive me if I've gotten the wrong message), you'd have no problem with a woman who fantasized about being nailed by aliens, but you find the notion of a woman getting turned on by rape "illogical." Rape in the fantasy realm is just that - fantasy. Most women who harbor rape fantasies wouldn't get turned on if confronted by a real rapist; they'd be terrified, angry, and rightfully upset. There's a huge difference between what we use in our thought process to get us ready for masturbation, and what happens in a dark parking lot. If everyone's fantasy had to be "logical," this forum would be a much duller place. I say, thank goodness for illogical fantasies!
     
  8. Texas_Red

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    I think you completely misunderstand my posting. The only thing I am saying is that I understand what the OP is saying. It breaks down like this:
    Rape = Do Not Want
    Fantasy = Do Want
    Rape Fantasy = Paradox

    To want something you do not want. By definition it isn't rape then is it? It's just a forceful fantasy. Since the fantasy includes wanting it, it cannot be rape. Thus the paradox.

    I have no issue with it being illogical. If it gets you off, then I salute you. :)
     
  9. andretti

    andretti New Member

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    Tex, I was referring to what the original poster wrote, not your comments....

    (I think I understood you; I was just giving my take on the original post).
     
  10. Texas_Red

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    Oh crap. I see that now. Why did I see my name as the quoted originally? I feel silly now.
     
  11. Silverback

    Silverback Member

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    I think it comes down to the grey area between role-play / fantasy and probably the misuse of the word rape. I get the OP's point and Tex; nobody wants to be raped, but they may want the forcefulness or the feeling of helplessness in their sex that they believe they would experience through rape hence the term. This is what people desire and fantasize about.

    The term rape-fantasy, I believe, is used as we perceive those feelings of helplessness and the forcefulness can only otherwise be experienced through rape.

    If people do explore these feelings / fantasies then it would become consensual role-play. The same theory can be applied to lots of fantasies or fetishes, for example being arrested or having a matriarchal figure change a grown man's nappy and treat him like a baby.

    I hope I'm making sense
     
  12. Texas_Red

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    Silverback: I get that. Really I do. What it comes down to is the OP seems to be coming at it from a purely logical standpoint. All I am saying is that I get that, and have done my best to make what OP is saying simple for everyone to understand. I already get everything else. :)
     
  13. Silverback

    Silverback Member

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    I get it too mate, I understand what your point is and I don't disagree, I'm just chucking my tuppence worth in too. Sorry if the tone in my post was once of discontent with your post I never meant it like that :)
     
  14. Texas_Red

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    It's no biggie, it just seemed like it was being thought that I shared the OPs inability to understand the idea of a rape fantasy and all that, when it couldn't be further from the truth. I only originally weighed in in the hopes of clarifying what OP was getting at is all.
     
  15. the_traveler

    the_traveler New Member

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    the only thing for sure here, is that the OP finally understands what the iniitals OP means!!! (kept thinking how did i get to be OPerator)
    anyway texas-reds statmens were 100% correct. spaking, humilation, babing, may stem from psychlogical guilt, being tied, helpess, may stem from need to be controled, and thus feel secure from the controller, it may also balance the existence of controlling other humans in regular life (the need to "let go" in day's end).
    but all these things are wanted.
    rape= where male x forces sexual intercourse on female Y without her concent, how he does it, is irrlelavent, it maybe coercsion, vioelance, drugs you name it. but the base point , the objection on the side being forced.
    if female Y wishes in her mind!! to have sex with male X, then all other aspects are nullfied as this violates the event's pre-condition,he can dress like the predator, tear her cloths off, though her on the floor, face down, pull her hair back, grab her throat, and slam into her brutallly till she bleeds, but if she wants it, it's not rape.
    therefore the term rape-fantasy cannot exists , it's like asking what happens if an unstoppble bullet hits an unbreakble wall (from the "what is the name of this book" book).
     
  16. johndeeregirl

    johndeeregirl New Member

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    some people are JUST submissive and enjoy being dominated in any way

    your quote sums up what it was for me.. the need to be able to give up control to someone I trust because in my everyday life - I am a bit OCD and NEED to be in control

    even though I don't do forced roleplays anymore, I still love when my fiancée takes charge
     
  17. Texas_Red

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    While this was the given assumed and used definition for the longest, it is not the case anymore. Rape is any non-consensual penetrative sex act. Thus men can be raped too.
     
  18. emsemtb

    emsemtb New Member

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    OK.....to sum this all up, cause my girl has this fantasy as well, and I will be honest, I am having a hard time wrapping my head around it due to my line of work, I can say it is more of a consensual non-consent sex act.....if that make sense. She has given me consent to take her in any way possible, as I see fit, even if she doesn't want it.....Odd in my little world, but as it may be, she get VERY aroused at the idea of that. She is also very submissive and we are currently engaged in a TPE relationship of the BDSM lifestyle, so I understand where the ideas and arousal come from, but I dont get why.....that is all....but I am sure I will some day.
     
  19. Texas_Red

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    A TPE you say? You should post more about this. TPE is something I've found myself both attracted to and yet repulsed (for lack of a better word) by. There is a part of me that could very much get into that and would like it, but it's not what I consider "me".
     
  20. the_traveler

    the_traveler New Member

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    what's TPE?
    if your girl has given you permission to take her in a way she doesn't want, i see only 3 possibilties
    1. the will stop you from doing it, in the first place.
    2. the won't stop you, being too submissive, but won't like it. (or fake it).
    3. she will like it, but either pretned she won't like it, or won't admit to herself she DOES like it.
    buttom line, if your girls enjoys what ever you do to her, then she would want it. nullifieng her original intenet and creating a universal paradox.