Sex and Culture

Discussion in 'Sex and Relationships' started by cbrmale, May 16, 2009.

  1. cbrmale

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    Please note that this thread splintered off the Sex and Childbirth thread.

    My wife read the links and she thought them rubbish, and she's the one who gave birth twice. I also asked my my sister as well, two children, and she gave a similar response, cramps and bleeding barely noticeable.

    In any case, the poor soul has a child four months old, and if his wife is having such problems at four months she is in deep trouble! She has time and energy for other activites, we know this, she just has no time or energy for sex with him. And, as I posted, looking after a normal and healthy baby is not as strenuous as many make out. It gets harder later, and still remains hard work when they are teenagers. But I hope she (the wife) isn't using teenagers as an excuse to avoid having sex with him in the years to come!

    If she loved him, she would find the time and energy to have sex with him. It's simple, really.
     
    #1 cbrmale, May 16, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: May 20, 2009
  2. Barbwire

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    Re: Sex after childbirth

    Sex does not equal love. Every time you say if a person really loved their partner they'd have sex, even if they weren't in the mood, you make me want to scream, cbrmale. You are wrong, plain and simple.

    What love is, is NOT acting like a child if you aren't allowed to have sex, to not carry a grudge because you aren't getting what you want or to whine and say, "But if you loved me, you'd have sex with me! Waaaaah, waaaaah!

    Oh, and aren't you the one that, when your wife wasn't fucking you like you thought she should, cheated on her, and when she found out you layed the blame on her. Now you say she fucks because she loves, I say, she fucks because she's afraid not to.

    Back to the OP, listen to HardRocker, he has given you the sanest advice posted thus far.

     
  3. cbrmale

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    Re: Sex after childbirth

    You don't understand men. Men typically equate love with sex, and if sex can be shared but isn't, they feel unloved. And if sex is shared, they feel loved. This is the way men are. Western women who don't understand this maxim and follow it through, do so at their own risk. I have read this maxim, and I studied it in psychology in fact. I felt this way myself in the past, and I have had many men confess it to me, wondering if their wives still love them because they don't have much sex anymore. It's not good or bad, it's just the way men are. What is clear to me from one-on-one discussions is that when wives deny their husbands sex for lengthy periods of time, it hurts those men badly. It's not a grudge, it's a hole where the love used to be. And when their children are growing up and their wives want sex again, they wonder why their husband's aren't passionate anymore. Well, you see, there's this hole where the passion used to be. And it may be so far gone that it's not coming back.

    My wife is African, and the stereotype of dark-skinned African women is what? Not African-American, African as in her cousins still live in huts in villages in the African bush. The stereotype of the dark-skinned African woman is sexual. This is because African culture has it's own dynamic, and one of those dynamics is that sex is to be shared, not repressed. And this is what I found myself with. At times she almost wears me out, and this is the truth.

    The other thing about Africans is they are very relaxed about children. They are tough on children, certainly tougher than Westerners, although never ever physically. But they are tough, and they expect children to behave and not intrude. African women never do the 'my child is the centre of the universe' thing that is very common with Western women. That never happens, they're too tough for that. Instead, they raise their children and give themselves time for their own needs, wants and desires, and also time for their husband's needs, wants and desires. This is the way Africans are, they are stoic and they are tough.

    Africans are relaxed about sex. So if a husband has sex with someone else, it's no big deal. It isn't called cheating, it's just sex. As long as he comes home, it's good.

    Don't try to psycho-analyse someone from a culture you know little about. She wanted children the way African women want children. She raised them the way Africans raise children. She is sexual with me the way Africans are sexual with their husbands.

    The one thing that went wrong was the influence of Christianity on African traditional beliefs. American Christian missionaries infiltrated her country and taught, amongst other things, that sex was evil, wicked and a temptation, as Christians tend to do. But she had no reference point for this drivel, nothing to put it into perspective. So on one hand she felt sexual, as is the way of her culture, and on the other hand she felt guilty, because she was taught to feel guilty about feeling sexual. And this guilt created problems for both of us until I eventually realised what was going on. From then on I harboured resentment towards Christians in general for their stupid beliefs, and towards American missionaries for carrying those stupid beliefs to places where they are not needed.

    African beliefs about sex and children and marriage are part of a culture that stretches back thousands of years. Other cultures have different beliefs, and I am very glad that I had a chance to sample a different set of beliefs from a different culture. And while those beliefs were different, they were closer to African than Western. That is, sex is not there to be repressed, and children are not the be-all and end-all of a woman's existance.

    My point in all of this is that Western women can keep acting like Western women, and find themselves with this perpetual conflict over sex in marriage once children have appeared on the scene. Or they can, perhaps, enlighten themselves and see how other cultures do it, be it African or Asian, and maybe learn something really useful.
     
  4. loveit247

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    Re: Sex after childbirth

    Cbrmale. You are totally generalising on African Culture again. There are many many different views on sex. Including very supressed views.

    BTW, my SO does not equate sex with love. He equates kindness and affection with love.
     
  5. Puss_in_boots

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    Re: Sex after childbirth

    So does mine. Cbr, I think you're generalizing about male behavior in general.
    My SO loves me too much to demand sex when he knows I'm not really in the mood for it. That whole, "I have needs and they're more important than yours and if you really loved me you'd have sex with me" line is completely outdated sexist bullshit.
     
  6. cbrmale

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    Re: Sex after childbirth


    The attached link will take you to a website which clearly explains the migration of the Bantu culture east and south of the point of origin. The map in particular should be very enlightening. As you can see, the majority of sub-Saharan Africa has a common cultural, religious and linguistic ancestry.

    http://www.south-africa-tours-and-travel.com/bantu.html

    While this is for basic people and basic understanding, it is close to what I studied in university on this subject. I used African religious and sexual morals and values as part of my psychology thesis, so well before I met my wife I had a good understanding of those components of African culture that are common and homogenous.

    An undergraduate thesis is a big thing and the research involved is massive. The reason we do a thesis is not to prove we can write, but to show how well we research and understand the subject matter. I really do have an understanding on subject of African culture and values.
     
  7. cbrmale

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    Re: Sex after childbirth

    You think I'm generalising? That's why I used the word typically, because it is a general comment about the majority of men, and it's based on research. I don't recall writing anything about demands when ones partner is not in the mood, nor did I write 'I have needs....'. I personally would never do such a thing, and when I found myself in such a situation that was getting too regular for comfort, I ended it.

    Recent research on this issue, and it's a very common one, showed that women who are married to wealthy and / or better educated men are more sexually active at year four plus of their relationships than women who are not married to such men. It was hypothesised by the researchers that these women make sex available to keep their man interested in them, and to keep other women away from a man they regard as being a good catch. While female sex drive equalled male sex drive at the onset of a relationship, it plummeted by an average of 50% after four years. Male sex drive remained high and was still constant after 20 years. The cause of this is thought to be evolutionary. Men’s continued sex drive was thought to serve as protection against being cuckolded, and women responded with low sex drives to their partners because they had evolved to seek other mates for more DNA in their offspring.

    I think most here would agree that the most powerful sex organ is the brain. So when the hormonal instinct to be sexual wanes, as it can, then that doesn't mean that sex must stop. But with many Western women, this is precisely what happens (or else we wouldn't have current psychological research on this issue). They expect their husbands or partners to be kind, considerate, loving and to take this sort of treatment in their strides. Some do willingly, some do begrudgingly, some don't. I think the begrudging partners are the most dangerous, because who knows what resentments they may harbour?

    I will be reporting your post as I feel the language is unacceptable.
     
    #7 cbrmale, May 19, 2009
    Last edited: May 19, 2009
  8. loveit247

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    Re: Sex after childbirth

    :lol:lol:lol

    Sorry, I just found this totally hilarious! Sour grapes much?
     
  9. Puss_in_boots

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    Re: Sex after childbirth

    Well, since you've reported my own post to me I feel that I cannot be the judge as to whether the post is truly as offensive as you seem to think it is. I shall therefore leave it up the the other forum mods and members. If they agree that the post is offensive and the language is (in your words) "obscene" and unacceptable, then I'll remove it.

    Personally I find it odd that you think it's so unreasonable and "obscene" that I think a man shouldn't demand sex from a partner who isn't really in the mood for it.
     
  10. loveit247

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    Re: Sex after childbirth

    Puss, as far as I can tell, there are no rules against using the bullshit. You stated your opinion and did not call him any names or swear AT him.. As I said in my above post, I think it may be sour grapes because of his little wrap on the knuckles earlier.

    I find there is not much point in arguing with him, he is ALWAYS right in his mind.
     
  11. Dreama

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    Re: Sex after childbirth

    OMG, it was sooo obscene, Puss. Actually, the post stays (or I'm not taking it down). Calling bullshit on something isn't against the rules, as far as I know.
     
  12. loveit247

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    Re: Sex after childbirth

    I spoke to my SO who has lived with Shona tribes. It is actually taboo for women to get wet during sex. They use herbs to dry up vaginal fluids. He also said that Shona women are meant to be modest about sex. Interesting. He is more then willing to join here and argue that fact too.

    My SO also called bullshit on the sex equates love argument.
     
  13. cbrmale

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    Re: Sex after childbirth

    You do know that there is no tribe in Zimbabwe called Shona? They speak dialects based on a language called chiShona, but there is no Shona tribe as such. My wife is part-Zezuru on her Zimbabwean side. If your SO lived with them he should know this, as it's been an inaccuracy since the first white settlement of Rhodesia (they all speak more-or-less the same language, so they must be the same). Even today, you will see this inaccuracy on the Internet.

    The story about using herbs to dry out vaginal secretions actually comes from another part of Africa; it was reported as being for special occasions only, and as far as I could tell was a bit of a myth. Even if it wasn't mythical, it certainly wasn't standard sexual practice for the tribe involved. Stretching the inner labial lips to provide additional stimulation for both partners is Zezuru practice, however (for women, lengthened inner labia provides additional indirect stimulation to the clitoris on each thrust). There are a few other sexual practices my wife was taught by her Granny, which are what young men and young women typically learn from their Grannys. A lot of things you won't find on the Internet, that's for sure.

    Why on earth would you argue about Zimbabwean culture to someone who's married to a Zezuru woman for heaven's sake?
     
  14. loveit247

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    Re: Sex after childbirth

    I am sending him this link so that he can join up and correct you. Oh and by the way, he IS Zimbabwean.
     
  15. loveit247

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    From my SO, who laughed himself near to tears at some of the "information" you provided. This is a man who was born in Zim, lived there for 29 years and lived with the Shona people.

    Points to tell that not nice word, edited out, sorry!

    1. ChiShona is the language spoken by the Mashona tribe of Zimbabwe and south eastern Mozambique, not a tribal name..
    2. The Mashona People are made up of the following predominant clans, Barwe, Manyika, Ndau, Korekore, Shangwe, and Guruuswa.The original Shona occupants of Zimbabwe are all embodied under the umbrella name “Hungwe”. The conquerors of the Hungwe fall under the blanket name “Mbire”. It is believed that it was the Mbire who were the founders of the Mutapa Empire as well as the Rozvi Empire which was destroyed by the various Nguni tribes that passed through the land of Zimbabwe during the Mfecane wars. Namely, the Ndebele tribe, who now occupy southwest Zimbabwe, and the Shangane tribe in the southeast of Zimbabwe. The Hungwe settled in Zimbabwe for probably two to three hundred years before the Mbire arrived.

    Its important to note that the difference between the present day Mbire (which refers to the Marondera – Wedza district and the people whose is Mutopo is Soko), and the 1500 A.D. Mbire. In about 1500 A.D. the term referred to all the members of the invading family which took over the land from the Hungwe. The Mbire took over the land of Zimbabwe around somewhere between 1000 and 1050 AD. Their invasion from across the Zambezi river marked the beginning of the dynasty of the Mbire empire which is commonly known as Mutapa Empire (state). The Mutapa Empire or Mbire Empire covered most pasts of present day Zimbabwe . The empire incorporated most of the whole of Mozambique , South of the Zambezi river and north of the Sabi river down to the sea. Some of the present day South Africa tribes are known to have been segmented from the Shona (best known ones are the Venda and Lovendu). The expansion of Mbire Empire, include the following Shona tribes Barwe, Manyika, Ndau, Korekore, Shangwe, and Guruuswa.

    4. A traditional southern African sexual practice—dry sex—aimed at pleasing men, could promote the spread of HIV-1, researchers warn.
    Many women in the region willingly insert herbal aphrodisiacs, household detergents, and antiseptics into their vaginas before sex, to ensure they are "hot, tight, and dry". This is the way their men like them, they say. The agents increase friction during sex and although painful for women, they are prepared to forego their own pleasure to ensure their partners return to them. The substances used by the women could cause disruption of membranes lining the vaginal and uterine wall. In addition, excessive drying could lead to abrasive trauma during sexual intercourse. She says the study indicates the need for urgent public-health intervention in the women who use drying techniques, especially since the effective use of condoms may be compromised by intravaginal substance use.