Kim davis jailed for contempt in kentucky gay marriage dispute

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by Barent, Sep 3, 2015.

  1. Barent

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    Finally, something is being done about this elected official, who is breaking the law by not issuing marriage licenses to same-sex couples.

    Kim Davis Jailed for Contempt in Kentucky Gay Marriage Dispute
    By ALAN BLINDERSEPT. 3, 2015 NY Times

    ASHLAND, Ky. — A federal judge here on Thursday ordered a Kentucky clerk jailed for contempt of court because of her refusal to issue marriage licenses to same-sex couples.

    The clerk, Kim Davis of Rowan County, was jailed after a hearing before Judge David L. Bunning of Federal District Court. The contempt finding was another legal defeat for Ms. Davis, who has argued that she should not be forced to issue licenses that conflict with her religious beliefs.

    “The court cannot condone the willful disobedience of its lawfully issued order,” Judge Bunning said. “If you give people the opportunity to choose which orders they follow, that’s what potentially causes problems.”

    Judge Bunning said Ms. Davis would be released once she agreed to comply with his order and issue the marriage licenses.

    Ms. Davis tearfully testified that she had not hesitated to stand by her religious views and defy the courts. “I didn’t have to think about it,” she said. “There was no choice there.”

    At the hearing, Ms. Davis, an Apostolic Christian, was asked how she defined marriage.

    “Marriage is between one man and one woman,” she replied, before a lawyer asked her whether she had “the ability to believe marriage is anything else.”

    Ms. Davis offered a terse response: “No.”

    Later, one of the women who has unsuccessfully sought a marriage license in Rowan County, April Miller, told Judge Bunning that Ms. Davis’s stand “marginalizes us again.”

    Judge Bunning left little doubt about his thinking, and said Ms. Davis’s explanation for disobeying his order was “simply insufficient.”

    “It’s not physically impossible for her to issue the licenses,” he said. “She’s choosing not to.”

    While many observers had expected the judge to declare Ms. Davis to be in contempt, few believed he would jail her on Thursday. But Judge Bunning said he thought merely fining Ms. Davis would not be enough to prompt her compliance.

    As marshals led her from the courtroom, Ms. Davis said, “Thank you, judge.”

    Thursday’s court ruling was the first since the Supreme Court on Monday turned down Ms. Davis’s appeal of an Aug. 12 ruling by Judge Bunning directing her to issue marriage licenses. The justices’ decision was expected to clear the way for same-sex marriages in Rowan County. But on Tuesday, the clerk and her employees again refused to issue licenses in Morehead, the seat of Rowan County.

    Within hours lawyers for the couples who had initially sued Ms. Davis asked Judge Bunning to hold her in contempt.

    Supporters and opponents of Ms. Davis gathered outside the federal courthouse here Thursday hours before she was due to appear. One man waved a rainbow flag — a symbol of the gay rights movement — while another clutched a flag that said, “Liberty.”

    “We’re supporters of the rule of the law,” said David Wills, a computer programmer from West Virginia who was first in line and said he had arrived at 4 a.m. for a hearing scheduled to begin seven hours later. “It’s just really important to me that people be treated equally, fairly.”

    Thursday’s court ruling was the first since the Supreme Court on Monday turned down Ms. Davis’s appeal of an Aug. 12 ruling by Judge Bunning directing her to issue marriage licenses. The justices’ decision was expected to clear the way for same-sex marriages in Rowan County. But on Tuesday, the clerk and her employees again refused to issue licenses in Morehead, the seat of Rowan County.

    Within hours lawyers for the couples who had initially sued Ms. Davis asked Judge Bunning to hold her in contempt.

    Supporters and opponents of Ms. Davis gathered outside the federal courthouse here Thursday hours before she was due to appear. One man waved a rainbow flag — a symbol of the gay rights movement — while another clutched a flag that said, “Liberty.”

    “We’re supporters of the rule of the law,” said David Wills, a computer programmer from West Virginia who was first in line and said he had arrived at 4 a.m. for a hearing scheduled to begin seven hours later. “It’s just really important to me that people be treated equally, fairly.”

    http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/04/us/kim-davis-same-sex-marriage.html?_r=0
     
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  2. Dog_E_Ryder

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    Now only if they will jail the rest of the corrupted officials breaking the law....Clinton...Obama....and ......... :) They are all criminals from top to bottom. It just depends what the buzz of the day offense is that determines who goes to jail and who doesn't. :)
     
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  3. Barent

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    This is not about "corruption". She is using her government job to force her religious beliefs on others, which is against the First Amendment.
     
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  4. Dog_E_Ryder

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    LiKe I said they are all corrupted. They all use their position, be that forcing their religious beliefs or or fatten their wallet. Breaking the law because they can is all the same breaking the law. The reality is if she was unwilling to carry out the law. she should step down, if she didn't then they simply move to impeachment which is a process that should have been carried out. I thought she was in wrong as well, my point is the punishment should be enforced rather it is refusing to do your job or corruption of your job.
     
  5. DayPlay3

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    Keeping strictly to the OP's point. In private business try telling your boss I can't do the job you hired me for because my Supreme Being
    told me I don't have to. It would be don't let the screen door hit you on the ass on your way out.

    I respected everyone's right to believe what ever they want about their God(s). When you put your beliefs on others you cross the line.
     
    #5 DayPlay3, Sep 3, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 3, 2015
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  6. Dog_E_Ryder

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    Give you a little history of the area, I been to that area a few times, back years ago when I played ball. If you ever watched the show "justified" then you have a good idea how politics works in the area, even at that, like any other smalltown USA, Gays are relatively pretty safe of homophobic hate crimes in those small town despite what the MSM would lead you to believe, the fact is your bigger cities is more likely where a hate crime is more likely to take place against the gay community. Then again to get back to the point of the OP, yes the county clerk failed to carry out her duties and should be impeached, but instead the Judge chose to make a PC move to arrest her for failure to carry out her duties instead of fining her and starting impeachment proceedings, this action will probably cause resentment of the locals in that community which in turn will cause animosities against the gay community that didn't exist before the unnecessary way this was handled. So even though she needed to be impeached, to jail her will cause problems that didn't need to happen.
     
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  7. Candela

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    She was wrong to try to carry out HER beliefs to others..Why people just dont let a person be who he/she wants to be is beyond me..Yes she is in jail and this is the beginning of the end of her being a judge.Justice is served!!
     
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  8. Barent

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    If she had, for example, refused to issue marriage certificates to Black people, would be unwise to arrest her because it might put the Black community at risk for reprisals by racists, who support her actions?

    We can't let people off the hook just because we fear their allies, that would be cowardly.
     
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  9. Dog_E_Ryder

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    She wasn't going being let off the hook she would have been impeached. You didn't even read what I posted. I was saying the way it was handled will lead to that when it didn't have to. That was what I was saying earlier, if we are going to lock up officials for not doing their job the jails are going to get overcrowded fast. Trust me there is a lot bigger fish to fry than her.
     
  10. DayPlay3

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    Dog - I know that part of the country too. While I do understand the social commentary on the away of life there, I would offer that is irrelevant to the Bill of Rights that our nation was founded on. We just don't restrict people's unalienable rights to appease the masses.

    If someone is going to be homophobic, having or not having a marriage lic. isn't going to change anything.
     
  11. Dog_E_Ryder

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    She wasn't a judge she was a county clerk, yes she was wrong she should have been impeached yes jailed no. If not doing your job as a public official, we better start building more prisons. :)
     
  12. Dog_E_Ryder

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    Oh trust me I do know the constitution. :) I said she was wrong impeach her or start jailing the rest of the crooks.
     
  13. Barent

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    She's not going to remain in jail, it's just symbolic.

    There is no "bigger fish to fry" than religionists' attempts to make their faith part of government rule. America was founded on freedom and democracy, not religious dogma and hate. I would not stop anybody from practicing their belief system, unless it interfered with my freedom to be exempt from it - but people like her do not believe that this is the way the country should be run, and will do anything and everything in their power to destroy the concept of separation of church and state.
     
  14. DayPlay3

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    Yes I did read your post. I'm not sure if Impeachment apples to an overt and blatant Criminal offense?

    One thing that is a truism about our Legal System if one what's to be made an example off they will certainly get their wish.

    I'm not very please with the wide spread corruption that exists either but, in this thread I'll limit myself to the OP's topic.
     
  15. Barent

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    If you know the constitution, and the law, you would also know that there's such as thing as a right to a trial. Politicians who are crooks are regularly prosecuted, maybe not all get convicted, but many have been brought to justice.
     
  16. Dog_E_Ryder

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    It's symbolic only in the sense of political correctness that's my point. If you have ever read any of my post you read I'm far from being a fan of organized religion, if you think that it is the biggest fish to fry in our problems in the world, then I have a bridge up your way I can sale you.:) LIke I said she should be thrown out of office, she was only jailed for exactly what you said to make a point.

    That's what the hell is wrong with this country they fall for the slight of the hand trick every time, they can tell you who the Kardashins or who is who on some reality show. The only news they hear is the PC issue of the week blaring down the newswire and focus on stupid shit going on, that could be handled intelligently, instead a huge fucking stink is going on about some silly ass lady who refused a marriage licence. Fine impeach her ass, but no as usual both side of the political spectrum make a circus out of it while Obama is out renaming some mountain and preaching the perils of mankind's destruction of the earth that might take place in 10,000 years or might not.

    In the mean time Rome is burning down....the deficit clock surpasses another trillion dollar mark, Isis acquires another dozen oil wells to help finance their goal of world domination, while creating real human right atrocities. China builds another artificial island in the pacific acquiring another strategic point for I wonder what? Putin lust past grandeur while humming the USSR hymm. While our idiot POTUS is negotiating with a terrorist state of Iran for a treaty that virtually assures them acquiring nuclear weapons, oh wow now you want to talk about religion? These people think they will cash in on 72 virgins when they press the big red button. Oh wait a minute we will be inspecting those facilities...but wait...no they get to inspect those facilities themselves, I feel much better now. We have a presidential candidate that could have taught Nixon a few tricks and was most likely partially responsible for the Benghazi debacle. The big joke is she still polls 1st place for the nominee of her party, What's that say about America. Healthcare is insane don't even get me started on that one, both parties need to burn in hell for that one. And again this year choice for president will be...Douche bag or Shit sandwich...maybe we should have tried to look a little harder for a candidate...BUT....... we have more important issues to deal with right now like crazy ass ladies refusing marriage license..how fucking dare that bitch!! lock her ass up. To the stretching racks with her!! :D
    Sorry Dude much more pressing issues needing addressing than some crazy Bitch down in rural KY denying licenses. Impeach her and go on with it.
     
    #16 Dog_E_Ryder, Sep 3, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 3, 2015
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  17. Dog_E_Ryder

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    I heard they have lease options on that bridge. . ;)
     
  18. Meee

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    I assume she's enjoying sex with her jail mates tonight.
     
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  19. Mr.Coffee

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    Was happy to hear this.

    There are opinions, there are beliefs... and then there are basic inalienable rights.

    People should not get these mixed up.
     
  20. sandwich

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    My response has nothing to do with my opinion on the Supreme Court decision in and of itself.

    I can't help but wonder what it would be like to be forced to do something that was not part of the original job I agreed to do. This would apply to any job. Was she warned that she would one day possibly be required to issue marriage licenses to same sex couples?

    I realize that some job descriptions have a 5 or 10 percent "other" portion, but this would not be included in that because she was already issuing marriage licenses.

    Freedom is tricky. I think to stay free we need to be able to make room for religious beliefs whether we agree with them or not. It seems she decided her higher power or whatever you want to call it has more authority in her life than the Supreme Court. All sorts of concessions are made in this country for freedom of religion, and this present situation should not change that even though the social winds are blowing in a different direction.

    People are fucking big time with the Constitution/Bill of Rights and the separation of powers.

    There is likely a solution that would allow her to keep her job without her being the one to issue same sex marriage licenses. There is a way.

    All of you here have at least one belief you could not give up even for the esteemed majority judges of the Supreme Court. Maybe the rest of us would not agree with you, but we would make room for your conviction. Do NOTHING to give up your freedoms! Every tiny bit of freedom you give up will lead to another tiny bit being taken away. Let the woman be free to stay true to her beliefs and let the same sex couples be free to stay true to theirs.

    I personally did not take the Supreme Court decision as a win or a loss for humanity. It was more of a sign of the present culture and a recognition of equality among our citizens in a way that had not been allowed.
     
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