Education For All?

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by 10_3XL, Feb 28, 2015.

  1. 10_3XL

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  2. Mikey22

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    Good topic 10 3 XL Point #1 Oboma can go straight to Hell!!! I'll coment more when I got more time.:eek:
     
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  3. Mikey22

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    I agree with most of the coments above, When the almighty comunity organiseing golfer, Who was raised among comunists is standing on the world stage promoteing education, I have to question what is being taught in that education. Is it something the student can use to better his or her life, Or is it about pushing a liberall agenda that is destroying the United States..
    Then comes to the question of who pays for it. It should be paid for by the student or the students parents, Not the tax payer. Another line Obama likes to use is. That the rich needs to pay there fair share, The truth is though, There is not enough rich to pay for all the crap Oboma wants to do, We will all pay for it along with our children Grand children and Great grand children. 18 Trillion in debt and going up every day.:mad:10 3XL Dont men to rant, But I find these things disturbing.
     
  4. lbushwalker

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    Mickey with the greatest respect get an education, learn English grammar or at the very least turn on your spelling checker.
    Australia used to have free i.e. tax funded tertiary eduction which for a decade or two made us the "smart" and therefore one of the most advanced countries in the world but now due to wise conservative men it is back to user pays and we have fallen behind the rest of the western world because only the wealthy can afford to be educated.
    Educating the young is an investment in a country's future just as valuable and perhaps more so than building roads, rail, ports and such other major infrastructures.
     
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  5. Mikey22

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    Educationally I'll be honest about it. I have a learning disability I was told of this when I was verry young. No amount of structured school would make it better. I was told it would be a waste of time trying. I've formed my opinions through my own lifes experence and watching the politics of it. I believe the Federall government has No business being in the education business, It should be kept at the state and local levels. Just last week I heard the average college graduate comes out with One hundred Thousand dollars in debt. With there college loans. These loans you can't get out from under through bankruptcy, They will follow you the rest of your life, If they are not paid back. 100 K Should be part of the home you hopefully own some day. The closer we get to the next election. The young 20 something liberall crowed will come out, They are college educated. Tearing up some park somewhere, Protesting Wall Street, Or big Business. Lobbying the Government to make them the Tax payer pay there loans.

    Big Business and small Business is where we all get our jobs. I'm smart enough to know to be in business you have to turn a profit. When Big Government people like Obama Go after the corprate Fat cats with Taxes and Bull Shit regulations. The rich might shut his or her company down, Move it to China Put thousands of people out of work. The Gvernment solution is give them all wellfare. Wellfare is no replacement for a job. But What do I know? I'm no smarter than a 5th grader.
     
  6. 10_3XL

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    @Mikey22 - First I feel it necessary to point out that the majority of the comments pictured in that thread are from my friends & associates being satirical and posting "in character" representing the extreme Right or just flat out being smartasses. I don't think you caught that when you stated your agreement with "most of the above comments."

    I'm also curious to know what reliable sources you are using for your information regarding Obama, his policies, and his general intentions. Obama wasn't "raised among communists" - he was born and raised in Honolulu, HI; for a short time in Jakarta, Indonesia; and then received his higher education at Occidental College, Columbia, and Harvard. Even when living in Indonesia during his childhood he had no Communistic influence - he was attending a private Catholic school and then a public school. Indonesia, incidentally, is a presidential representative democratic republic rather like the United States. (For the record, there have never in the history of the world to my knowledge and research been any Catholic Communists... in fact I'm pretty certain that's a paradox.)

    What is being taught in the education that would be provided would be whatever the hell the student decided to learn. He's not placing stipulations or restrictions on what degree/major students will pursue. Obama isn't saying "Free community college for all - but only if you get a degree in engineering!" He's saying, "For chrissake go get an education so you can help fix this country!"

    I also fail to see how "a liberal agenda" is destroying the United States when it is the majority of Extreme Right and Neo-Conservative and post-Reagan "Republican" politicians, policies, and actions that have so greatly damaged the integrity, reputation, and outlook for Our Nation over the past years.

    Who pays for it? Well, let's see - it would be the taxpayers. Personally, I see absolutely no problem with that - nor would I have any qualms over paying increased taxes if it meant a ready availability for all citizens of the USA to get a post-high school education. A more educated populace would greatly increase our strength as a Nation, as a People, and as a part of Humanity in general. A huge part of many of the issues in our world today derive from a lack of enlightenment and education. That lack is caused largely by the restriction on knowledge - which should be free for all. This is not Soviet Russia or North Korea - our education system is not merely another venue for the Government to spew political propaganda and brainwash the masses. While I have many issues with the United States' Education system that is not one - as it is not an issue inherent in the system. A larger number of the public that are educated would mean that policies, actions, legislation, and other such things would be getting proposed, considered, voted on, and passed by people with a much higher competency level for making such important decisions.

    You say that a higher education should be paid for by the students or the students parents; not the taxpayers. Have you looked at the disgusting increase in the cost of a college education over the past half-century? A quick sample of the ever increasing costs is shown in the fact that in 1976 the tuition costs at Yale were $6425; in 1986 it was $16,040; in 1996 it was $28,880, for the current school year tuition is $63,250!

    Here's the official PDF from Yale that I'm getting these numbers from.

    Do you have that kind of money? Can you get a loan for that kind of money? I know we're not all headed to an Ivy League school, but that's a pretty fair demonstration of the costs of a higher education in the USA these days. Even when I was looking at the We Learned U Good Colleges here in my home state I was facing a bill of about $25,000 for a 2-year degree. So, if somehow people do manage to get the finances (through massive loans) then they're facing the wide range of 15 to 25 years to pay off all of their student loans.

    You mention taxation of the rich and that even if they were more heavily taxed that it would not present enough new finance to our Government to make a difference. As of 2013, in a national economic analysis by lifetime economists Emmanuel Saez and Gabriel Zucman, the wealthiest 160,000 families own as much as the poorest 145,000,000 families. To top that, the wealth mentioned is about 10 times the disparity as that of family income. Here's a visual aid:
    wealth_disparity.png
    You cannot tell me with a straight face and 100% honesty that the upper class in America doesn't have the means to pay more in taxes or have enough to distribute a larger share to those less fortunate. Besides, increased taxation of the higher earners/more wealthy would (I assume) have little to no effect on you. Unless I'm mistaken, Mikey, you aren't one of the 1% - you're down here in the 99% with the rest of us. The quantity of wealthy/upper class citizens in our country is a moot argument - there could be only one rich man in all of Our Nation, but if he has 87% of the wealth and an income to match then that needs to be factored into the equation and compensated for.

    You mentioned the National Debt - so consider this:
    The USA has a debt-to-Gross Domestic Product ratio of 101%. That doesn't sound like a whole lot, but in absolute terms, our debt is rapidly approaching $18 trillion. In comparison, Japan's debt is approximately $13.4 trillion, with an economy that is only 1/4 the size of the USA's. Also, it is important to note that little of the US National Debt debacle is directly the fault of Obama. Most was inevitable due to spending/lending/borrowing practices established during the Presidency of George W Bush (Jan, 2001 - Jan, 2009).

    You say you find these things disturbing? I say I find it disturbing that from all that I can tell from your post you are taking the verbal ejaculations of the Extreme Right and FOX News to be the gospel truth and not questioning anything you hear or verifying for yourself from various reliable and non-biased sources.

    PS - Your frequent misspellings, grammatical errors, and misuse of terminology basically discredited everything you said in your above statement.
     
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  7. 10_3XL

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    Yes, that money should go towards things like homeownership and otherwise improving your societal status. That's why a free college education is a blessing! With free college available then people wouldn't have those massive debts to worry about and take away from their ability to pursue their life's goals/dreams.

    An unrestricted and unregulated corporate America would be a fiscal disaster. It would allow for all of the business owners to decide what rights to give their workers - assuming they even felt like providing anything remotely resembling Workers' Rights. Basically work conditions could potentially slip back to pre- and early Industrial Revolution standards - you know, when children were used to clean out the cotton gins and stuff like that? You also seem to have missed the recent endeavors by American corporations to keep their jobs in-house and on American soil (I cite Chrysler's - one of America's Big Three automakers - moves to bring jobs back to the USA). Outsourcing is going to be a problem with or without the regulations and taxation imposed by the Government on business-owners.
    Are you serious? Have you tried applying for financial assistance from the Government? First of all - most Welfare programs are State-level; not Federal. 2nd the majority of what I call "3rd Generation Welfare Recipients" (those who live off Welfare and do little or nothing to contribute to society) are uneducated, ignorant, and are only being supported by the Government because of various legal loopholes that have grandfathered them into receiving benefits. Most people on Welfare are honest people who have fallen on hard times, and many honest, decent, hardworking Americans who should be receiving Welfare do not because they have been denied financial assistance. At one point in time in my past I was working for minimum wage, 60+ hour weeks, anywhere from 6-8 days straight with no days off. During that time I had massive medical bills that I had to pay, cost-of-living expenses, and (oh my god, go figure!) student loan debt to pay from a failed attempt at college. I went through all the bureaucratic nonsense and attempted to get financial assistance from the State. Despite the fact that I was over $373 below what was labeled as the "Poverty Line" I still "had too high of an income to qualify for assistance."

    I am still having trouble giving any credence to your claims/arguments. You don't seem to be doing any personal pursuit of information and simply accepting the first and most memorable soundbite you hear on FOX News.
     
  8. lbushwalker

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    Mickey22; apologies of my critism of your spelling and grammar. It is difficult enough having learning issues without being reminded.
     
  9. Mikey22

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    I agree with you on the third generation Wellfare recipients. But let me give 3 examples of young people I've observed over the last year at my work.
    Employee#1 and 2. Both make minimum wage working at a temp agency, Company offers them a job raiseing them to $10.00 hr. In a year they will make $13.00 hr. Company also offers Health insurance retirement etc.
    Employee #1 turns it down, Says he has a son to suport, And he can't loose his subsidy check for Oboma care. So he has Obama care, But he's going to raise his son on $7.00 hr.

    Employee #2 Offerd the same. Turned job down because he has to take a drug test. So smoking his fucking dope is more important than trying to better himself finatually.

    Then we come to employee #3 Working the job I have 45 cents per mile and a % of the load, You can make a good liveing on this. My phone rings while I'm on vacation. I think maybe he is lost or something, No his question is " Can I make it home in a day? " I tell him No He has drove 3 hours and allmost to the first stop, He turns the truck around Drives back and quits. He has a pregnat wife that is in college. WTF?.

    I doubt seriously that these 3 are college material anyway. But they are products of todays k through 12 school. Now my sister and Fater are College graduates and when they went there were standards You had tests to pass to get in. Not anyone and everyone can handle college level work. Regardless of there finatual situation.

    So you ask make it Free for everyone? Free does not mean Free. Somebody has to pay. Now given the examples I gave above, Do you honestly think that Junior or 4 year college will do them any good. I have my doubts.
     
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  10. 10_3XL

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    Numer One probably doesn't understand how the Affordable Health Care act works - which is a common issue and is causing a lot of problems. People are not taking the time to actually read up on it and do their research, so there are lots of misconceptions about what is/what is not a part of "Obamacare" and how the system works (or is intended to work). If he has a son to support then the Affordable Health Care act wouldn't help him beyond medical/medical insurance costs. It isn't a Welfare program like TANF, SSI, or SSDI that provides financial assistance to those in need of support.

    Number Two sounds like he was making a decision to avoid potential criminal charges, imprisonment, fines, and loss of his job/reputation. Do you know for a fact that it was because his dope was more important? What if he is on a medication that could potentially light up a drug test? What if he is getting clean, but at the time of the job offer he would have been unable to clear a drug screen? Even still - there are plenty of losers out there who'd rather live for their instant gratification than a payoff down the road.

    Number Three is a pretty straightforward and easily understandable case. He signed on to be a driver; he was idealistic in his hopes to be able to make it home easily/frequently. When he found out that wasn't the case then he followed his personal priority of Family over Work - to be there and available for his pregnant wife and unborn child.


    When you talk about your sister and father being college grads and having to pass entrance exams and standards... That would still hold true if Obama passed legislation to make college free to everyone. You're not taking into account that people would still have to pass entry exams and meet specific requirements before receiving their college education - just as it is now. It's not an attempt to give free handouts to everyone; it's an attempt to get those who are qualified into the higher education system without charge.

    And, no - I'm not entirely sure (having never met these individuals and only having the information you have provided me) that these above mentioned people are collegiate material. However, if they were potential college grads that never went to school because they couldn't afford it (either presently or in the long run) then I think it's a great loss. Who knows what they could have accomplished in and after college?

    You also pointed out they completed a K-12 education course but no college. That leads me to the assumption that they're trying to do a very difficult and demanding job (OTR trucking?) in order to get adequate pay to live on because that is probably the only job available for men of their education level and age group. If education on a collegiate level were free and available to everyone then they might very well have gone to college, succeeded there, and moved on to bigger and better things rather than making desperate (and frequently ill-advised/failed) attempts to break even. I don't have a college degree (it's a long story that I won't go into here but...) that gave me the following options for work:

    Wage-slave grunt work in the food industry.
    Wage-slave grunt work in retail.
    Wage-slave grunt work at a call center.
    Wage-slave grunt work in a very select few medical jobs.
    Wage-slave grunt work in a warehouse.
    (Do you notice a recurring theme in those listings?)

    All of the above have little to no career betterment available - basically a locked in at entry-level 'til death position. Or if vertical rather than lateral promotions in the companies were available then the Job Expectations to Pay & Benefits ratio was ridiculous and not worth it. I couldn't even have joined the Military and made it with my qualifications - the best I could have hoped for was P/T Reserves, and there's no way in hell that would have paid the bills.

    It should never come down to a choice between Education and Prosperity - especially when even if you choose to forego one there is no guarantee of the other.
     
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  11. Mikey22

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    Good debate 10 XL In the case of #1 and 3 I was taught that you are expected to do everything in your power to suport your family finatually. #1 was in a warehouse setting, Not hard work. I did the same job for a lot of years, and held down a day job also, For those years I worked between 60 and 70 hours a week. #3 quit his job on the spot, He was told up front that he would spend 2 nights at least on the road. Quiting a job like this in my view is a bad thing, You may have to Hustle to find another job. When you find the next job. You really can't use the last job as a good reference. #2 Pot is not legall in my state, He would have got fired, I doubt it would have gone any further. I'm allmost sure if he had a legimate medical condition, The company would have takin that in to consideration.

    For myself I was turned down by the Military. I worked severall jobs. And most were not good paying jobs. But I allways tryed to use what I learned along the way to better myself and my family. True I hold a far Right concervitve view on Government. I have to hand it to the democrats and the liberalls, They know how to rally there base, and turn out the voters when it counts.

    I view todays Republican party as being totally disfunctionall. They should come up with common sense plans and policy, They run and are elected on stopping the left. But they don't seem to have the balls to fight. And they just self destruct when it really counts. We suppose to have a congress and senate to debate all these things we see in the news every day. My view of Obama is he passes an unpopular heath care bill in the middle of the night, With hardly no oposition, He uses executive orders to pass laws that he wants, And won't enforce the ones all ready on the books. No it's not Soviet style Russia yet, But what will it be 40 50 or 100 years from now if this style of governing continues.
     
  12. 10_3XL

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    You're right that those guys didn't go about quitting their jobs in the best manner - I won't contend you on that. I do still think #3 is absolved, as he was focused on his family. #1 and #2 - that's far more of a gray area. I still wonder if #1 understood the extent and implication of the Affordable Healthcare Act (a.k.a. Obamacare). As I said - it only affects medical/medical insurance matters; it has nothing to do with financial assistance programs for day-to-day expenses. Unfortunately that is something that most people do not realize.

    Honestly, it's both the Republican and Democratic parties that are dysfunctional from my point of view. Basically whenever one says something, the other goes with the exact opposite just to be oppositional. Republicans say "Yes" - Democrats say "No." Democrats say "Up" - Republicans say "Down" and so on ad infinitum. It's unfortunate that we are stuck in a bipartisan system (that claims to not be a bipartisan system).

    Obama passed the healthcare bill, but it was by no stretch of the imagination a sneak move or overnight - at least, not the form it has taken today. He signed the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act into law on March 23, 2010 (this is what came to be known as Obamacare). Since then it has seen so much opposition from both Democrats and Republicans and been revised, amended, and edited so greatly that it bears little resemblance to what President Obama initially proposed. And I have yet to see him use his executive power to force a bill into law, going over the heads of the other parts of our federal government.

    If our Government continues to run in the manner it is, we will likely suffer a very similar fate to that of the USSR. After years and years of the society wearing down and becoming more and more dysfunctional then with a whimper the once Great Empire will fall and have to be resurrected. Personally, I'm sitting around waiting to see what will be the USA's "Berlin Wall."

    But that is all a digression from the topic of his proposed Free Community College Plan. I also have failed to reiterate that it is only applicable to community colleges. Private universities would still remain as they are now. It also doesn't open the doors to any Joe Blow off the streets - as I said, potential students would still have to meet the basic requirements of attending a college. I think the potential pros far outweigh the potential cons. For one we would have a more highly educated general populous. This in turn would lead to more efficient and enlightened policies, laws, &c being proposed and passed by our politicians. Also, with a higher overall education level then issues within the education system could be more effectively handled, as less of the education process would fall on teachers' shoulders - children would be more able to ask questions of their parents and be likely to receive a helpful response beyond "Ask your teacher" or "Google it." With less pressure on teachers then our educators could focus more on the kids that are now labelled as "problematic" - those with learning disabilities or other issues that detract from their ability to learn...

    As for the funding. I think that, while additional taxation would be acceptable, I fail to see why budget cuts from other less necessary budget pools couldn't be made. I think we could stop buying the Military the proverbial $500 toilet seats and throw a little bit more money towards Our Nation's education system...

    I say all this, but then again - just as you're a Conservative - I'm a radical Leftist bleeding-heart Liberal commie bastard. :p
     
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  13. Mikey22

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    I can agree with you on a lot of this. As for the USA. Berlin style wall, I doubt it. I've heard it discussed that they want The North American union, Eraise the borders between Mexico and Canada. We could probably go in and out as we want, Since people from the rest of the world come and go that way. Just don't get caught in Mexico with a gun. It's all part of that one world government movement, The Buildibergs want to do.

    But on the serios side of funding the Government, Education and the rest of it. Why not a fair tax, Flat tax or consumtion tax. Abolish the IRS. Since we are all looked at as 99% Sucking off the tit of the 1%. There will allways be the mega rich people, Poor people and hopefully, There will be the people in between. If every American had skin in the game, Maybe comon sense on both sides could be reached. But I have my doubts. Most likely it will be the one world government thing Or we get blowed off the face of the earth in the next world war.

    Oh as far as #1 goes in my opinion, He should have took the job, He would make more money, Our health plan pays 80% And a family plan cost around $80.00 week, And it was a lot cheaper before Obama got a hold on it. It got my daughter and my wife through there bouts with cancer. So I think it's a pretty good plan so far.

    #3 Should have takin in the cosideration of being out of town, Before signing on, Maybe something in town or local would have ben better for him and his curent situation.

    #2 Just did not seem to be playing with a full deck anyway.
     
    #13 Mikey22, Mar 1, 2015
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2015
  14. Cappy_Dick

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    Had there been free i.e. tax funded tertiary education when I finished High School, I would not have gone into the military. I was the smart, nerdy, skinny kid. Really wasn't suited for military life. But, I came out of secondary school at the height of the industrial decline of the North East, later known as the "Rust Belt". All the jobs with good pay and upward momentum, with a high school education, that were a plenty as I was growing up, had pretty much vanished. I could not afford to go to college.

    So, this kid joined the army, in hopes the training would land me a "real job" in what was rapidly becoming a high tech world, of which I was smart enough to be able to become a part of. However, this became the first chapter of my attempts to better myself, which reads more like poet Robert Burns' "To a Mouse". Even those not familiar with Burns know the famous quoted line "The best laid schemes of mice and men / Often go awry". So to did my life without tertiary education.

    I adapted my personal views and pushed my physical limits to make it in the army. It wasn't a very pleasant experience, but I made it through so I could go to the nearly a year of tech school provided for the occupation I had selected in hopes of bettering myself. I was disappointed to find that active consisted of about 10% of "my job" and 90% of "playing army". I did however get to spend time in many different countries and adopt the worldly view that so many enjoy in my essays and commentaries. I also learned that the army was not a suitable career path for me to pursue to retirement.

    Three years later, I was back in the States. I now had a young family. The promotion score for my job, which had been at the minimum for the majority of my four year enlistment, suddenly rose to the maximum. I saw many good men forced out at ten years, without a pension, because they didn't make Sargent, due to a virtually impossible cut off score. I didn't want to be "that guy", so any thoughts I had of toughing it out another 16 years went down the toilet.

    I started applying for jobs in my "chosen field", but not getting any hits. I eventually learned that this "shortage field" had become over crowded during my 4 years of service. My time was up, so I moved back to my home town. I knew how to survive there. The economy was so bad, I couldn't even find a job as a "cart pusher". I went to sign up for my unemployment. To my horror, I soon found out I could only get 13 weeks of unemployment, because I "could have re-enlisted". Thirteen weeks later, still no job. I ended up on public assistance and a federal re-employment scheme. The re-employment scheme got me an OK job in the tech industry. Or so I thought, til a year later, when I was "laid off". The truth was, my 50% federal wage subsidy had expired and the owner brushed me aside to get a new worker, with a year's wage subsidy from the same program.

    So, here I am. No degree, no marketable skills and no money for college. No way to support my family while going to school, if I did. I had little choice but to become as @10_3XL so eloquently put it "Wage-slave grunt". The first stop on this road was actually my saving grace 25 years later.

    I got a lead to a contract janitorial service. I was in the army, so I knew how to make tile floors shine like glass. I got a job there at 25 cents over minimum wage. At that time, I could get pretty much all the hours I could work, but no time and a half over forty. Probably was illegal, but I didn't question it at the time. I made good money, but never had a vacation. I got very few holidays and days off. However, as time progressed, more and more businesses were going to having existing workers take turns at cleaning duties, so I got less and less hours. Hence, I graduated to the Wage-slave grunt world of retail.

    Most people who have worked retail have done so as a part time job. Either while as a student, or just to make ends meet. Trying to work in retail, for a living is a VERY hostile environment to be in. Completely thankless as well. Trust me. I spent over 20 years trying to survive this way, other than a 2 year stint in @10_3XL 's industry, when there were no other "un-skilled" positions available. The majority of my working life was wasted with no real advancement or retirement. I was forced out yet again in 2011, due to a certain big box corporation's move to eliminate most full time hourly positions. While I incurred a long term stint of unemployment, in the long run, they did me a favor.

    While unable to find a job, due to my area being especially hard hit by the economic downturn, I came to a revelation. I had 15 years of experience in the custodial arts. I also concluded that society would not run out of children. I decided to pursue the civil service sector. Finally, this fall, I got a position. I was at the end of my financial rope by then. However, I was blessed with some aid from a very benevolent friend, as well as some from a family member, I have been able to survive. I am not out of the woods yet, but I didn't loose my house and have heat in it. I have health care and enough to eat. Though nothing at all fancy, I have a vehicle that gets me from point A to B.

    No, While I don't have much else to show for my working life, at least I am earning a pension where I can hopefully retire comfortably one day. But, with an IQ over 120, I could have done so much better and therefore would be paying a lot more taxes that would help pay for free community college for those who need it, had it been available to me.

    In closing, I would like to point out that the political system in the USA is outdated and broken. Liberals point fingers at the republicans and Conservatives point fingers at the Democrats. Very few people understand how government works and simply choose to blame or praise the president in power for whatever is right or wrong. That's complete bullshit. It doesn't matter which side of the aisles they are on, all politicians, in the end, are about money. They are all rich and will do what benefits the rich of their way of thinking. This will not change unless the average Americans get behind a third party and get them voted in. The D &P have become totally partisan, and no longer co-operate. Until additional parties get a foothold, so that coalitions MUST happen, nothing is gonna change the endless push-me-pull-you ways of Washington.

    PushMePullYou.jpg
    xx
     
    #14 Cappy_Dick, Mar 1, 2015
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2015
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  15. Dog_E_Ryder

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    I am a Libertarian Fiscal Conservative/Social moderate finishing my MBA in marketing and I know numbers, that's my game , and I refuse to take part in this conversation, since this is a leisure sex site meant for fun. I will say I see a lot of skewed numbers. No comment. Enough said. :D
     
  16. Cappy_Dick

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    DUDE!

    The whole point of "The Lounge" was intended for "Non Sexual Discussion and Debate", which is what this thread is. It's called an "Off Topic" sub forum for a reason. Maybe you're more of a fan of the twitter like bullshit threads that some have tried to turn this section of the forum into. You certainly have the right to participate/not participate, however cutting folks down for having a non-sexual discussion on the sub-forum designated for such discussion is unnecessary, un-called for, not to mention lame. You said an awful lot for not wanting to participate. If you don't like this sort of discussion, that's fine. Leave it to those of us that do.

    xx
     
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  17. Dog_E_Ryder

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    Cappy said
    "In closing, I would like to point out that the political system in the USA is outdated and broken. Liberals point fingers at the republicans and Conservatives point fingers at the Democrats. Very few people understand how government works and simply choose to blame or praise the president in power for whatever is right or wrong. That's complete bullshit. It doesn't matter which side of the aisles they are on, all politicians, in the end, are about money. They are all rich and will do what benefits the rich of their way of thinking. This will not change unless the average Americans get behind a third party and get them voted in. The D &P have become totally partisan, and no longer co-operate. Until additional parties get a foothold, so that coalitions MUST happen, nothing is gonna change the endless push-me-pull-you ways of Washington."


    I agree with most you say here Cappy with the exception of the statement" political system is outdated." Broken yes; outdated no. The people are broken, is the problem. We elect our officials so they tell us what we want to hear. Like the old song of the Stones "Sympathy of the devil" Who shot the Kennedy's? it was me and you. We continue to elect those because we choose to. If a candidate does get up there and tell the truth he is run out of town like he has the plague. The truth is we don't want the truth, we can't handle the truth and refuse to believe the truth. So it would be insane for any politician to do otherwise. Just one example........
    1. Social security will go broke in 10 years or less. unless we move the retirement age up? buzzzzzzzzz no Increase with holdings on the worker? buzzzzzzzz no Increase the burden on business to contribute? probably....but then economy continues to tank...
    so the answer is Nothing. that's the answer. Count down continues... kick the can down the path.
    Money does run the system, but when the average american can't even name who the vice- president or speaker of the house is in this country, but can tell you the color of a dress on youtube or who fucked who on a showtime special is, wtf would you expect we would have in office as politicians? If you ask me they are very inefficient with campaign funding as well, they should be able to get these clowns in office for a grain of the amount they they use, obviously no one is paying much attention. I could go all day , but not going to get started. rant over. :)
     
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  18. Dog_E_Ryder

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    Obviously you have no clue who or what I am. I assure you I have more vast knowledge on this subject then you would care to hear about. :D Besides why the uncalled for smart ass remark no one was criticizing the thread, I was telling why I didn't say anything. DUDE lol
     
    #18 Dog_E_Ryder, Mar 1, 2015
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2015
  19. Cappy_Dick

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    Everyone here is a unique individual. I haven't gotten to know you personally, so no... You could be some kinda rocket scientist just as easy as you could be some 35 year old that lives in mom's basement and sits at the computer in his underpants all day. I wouldn't have a clue as to what you know.

    You are more then welcome to astound the participants of this thread with your knowledge, baffle us with your bull or go talk about the weather or what pissed you off today in the less serious "off topic" threads.

    My input to this topic was one of simple telling of the story of how this could have made a difference for me and therefore what/why my opinion is on it. If you disagree with @10_3XL 's statistics, I'm sure he'd love to hear what you have to say, as Wally takes his research pretty seriously.

    xx
     
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  20. Dog_E_Ryder

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    So why the crude,cutting remarks and crappy attitude cappy with us new people?( no pun intended;)) You show me where I criticized you or the thread? I didn't, you are the one who attacked my opinion of what I said. In fact if you would read, I had agreed with part of what you had to say. Far as statistics I know what I know, and have chosen not to get in a big dick contest with anyone, because I'm here for the fun of the site myself. I have been in the steel cage of many political forums and come out without a scratch.:) I have neither the desire or time to do so. I was making a comment of observation and keeping my opinion short and sweet, without getting into too much detail. Sorry ole fellow if you can't comprehend what I was saying. Good day Dude. :)